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Post by admin on Jul 19, 2009 21:02:06 GMT
Oh belt up. Look, just answer a simple question: were you 100% happy to see the World Cup won by the team scoring the second highest of actual points on the racetrack? It's the rules. They were known beforehand. It's not as if Australia haven't benefitted from the Joker before. They managed a straight passage to the final last season after deploying the Joker while the Poles hadn't been in a position to deploy the Joker. I don't recall you kicking up a stink over that. You win some, you lose some.
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Post by admin on Jul 19, 2009 21:11:26 GMT
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Post by Genghis on Jul 19, 2009 21:30:59 GMT
Oh belt up. Look, just answer a simple question: were you 100% happy to see the World Cup won by the team scoring the second highest of actual points on the racetrack? It's the rules. They were known beforehand. It's not as if Australia haven't benefitted from the Joker before. They managed a straight passage to the final last season after deploying the Joker while the Poles hadn't been in a position to deploy the Joker. I don't recall you kicking up a stink over that. You win some, you lose some. Actually go back a year on the FOTW threads (Week 54 to be exact) and following the meeting you detailed above, I nominated the Joker and it won FOTW that week. I'm impartial in these matters - if GB can't win the World Cup, I don't give a fuck whether it's Poland, Australia, Outer Mongolia, etc, I don't give a shit. But I do like to see the contest won fairly and squarely without the bloody silly joker deciding matters.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2009 23:05:51 GMT
Fair enough....say "bollocks" all you want, but it wont change the fact that when you look at point scoring stats from this season, Sully pisses all over Batchelor, and I'm sure Boycey knows it too. Of course they were crucial. But, in the end, so were Protasiewicz's 3 points (or whatever he scored) You say that SO dismissively...you deserve a slap for that! PePe scored the same as the great one in his first 4, but was sacrificed in his last one to help the team.....Gollob likely would have been too if he was programmed in that race. Let's not forget that PePe didn't JUST score 3....he took points from the Aussies with his sloth like performance at clearing the track
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2009 23:12:30 GMT
Hatcham - a manager can only work with what he's got. Cieslak has the better riders in the world, he shold walk the World Cup, not scrape it by a single point. Look my point is that the Poles should be good enough to win the World Cup in their own backyard without depending on the dreadful, despicable, horrible, shameful joker. Well why didn't you make the point I highlight in bold (which I'd have probably agreed with) rather than your original statement shown above. Apologies for disappearing after making my initial point and leaving you to battle things out with others but can you see where my annoyance in your first statement lies? I won't argue that over the whole of this years tournament Hampel was far superior to Gollob, but as a rule I'd say Gollob has so many more tricks up his sleeve than Jarek will ever have. On his day Jarek is devastatingly fast, but he doesn't have his days as often as he should. He should have won at least one GP (Hancock staying down at Cardiff being the biggest injustice he's suffered) but the fact of the matter is he hasn't. He was 'unfortunate' in being Polish really when it came to wildcards being dished out for the GPs. I sincerely hope he's back in soon as he's a competitive rider who I enjoy watching. Subedei does sum up the situation perfectly in that Poland do have a considerable strength in depth of good league riders, however they don't have many genuine top-liners that will be up there in the GP standings. I would say Poland were lucky to have got out of jail today and that Cieslak's loyalty to the riders who performed so well on Monday nearly cost him. I'd suggest that the track really didn't suit the team and if they'd had 'normal' conditions we'd have seen a clear cut Polish victory. Bottom line is though, the whole SWC competition again lived up to it's billing and provided a fantastic feast of entertainment. Roll on 2010 SWC - oh actually it's in Britain isn't it ? I hope it's at 'boro and not Cov. Rico
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Post by Deleted on Jul 19, 2009 23:18:12 GMT
He was 'unfortunate' in being Polish really when it came to wildcards being dished out for the GPs. Couldn't agree more... I think that in the last couple of years, Jarek has consistently been one of the top 10 in the World, if not top 5, but he has been unlucky with the qualification rounds and the selection process. I sincerely hope that we get to see him back in SGP next year.
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Post by Genghis on Jul 20, 2009 11:28:10 GMT
He was 'unfortunate' in being Polish really when it came to wildcards being dished out for the GPs. Couldn't agree more... I think that in the last couple of years, Jarek has consistently been one of the top 10 in the World, if not top 5, but he has been unlucky with the qualification rounds and the selection process. I sincerely hope that we get to see him back in SGP next year. Now that's something we can agree on. Hampel is way too good not to be in the GP series. He's a quality act - I reckon he would finish above Gollob in the GP series.
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Post by Genghis on Jul 20, 2009 11:29:30 GMT
But, in the end, so were Protasiewicz's 3 points (or whatever he scored) Yes, as were Gollob's paltry 6 points (or whatever he scored)
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2009 14:06:59 GMT
It's the rules. They were known beforehand. It's not as if Australia haven't benefitted from the Joker before. They managed a straight passage to the final last season after deploying the Joker while the Poles hadn't been in a position to deploy the Joker. I don't recall you kicking up a stink over that. You win some, you lose some. But I do like to see the contest won fairly and squarely without the bloody silly joker deciding matters. You've gone off the beam again old chap, i would imagine none of us on here like the joker, or double tactical in the elite, etc, but the world cup 2009 was won by Poland and it was totally fair and totally square..
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Post by Genghis on Jul 20, 2009 15:43:48 GMT
You've gone off the beam again old chap, i would imagine none of us on here like the joker, or double tactical in the elite, etc, but the world cup 2009 was won by Poland and it was totally fair and totally square.. Hatcham, yes I did go off one one yesterday regarding the joker. ;D I wasn't accusing the Poles of underthing underhand, it just really annoys me when the best team (Australia) doesn't end up winning because the Joker gives the Poles an extra two points. I would have been just as annoyed the other way around - and indeed I was after the opening round last year when it was the other way around.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 20, 2009 16:12:27 GMT
You've gone off the beam again old chap, i would imagine none of us on here like the joker, or double tactical in the elite, etc, but the world cup 2009 was won by Poland and it was totally fair and totally square.. Hatcham, yes I did go off one one yesterday regarding the joker. ;D I wasn't accusing the Poles of underthing underhand, it just really annoys me when the best team (Australia) doesn't end up winning because the Joker gives the Poles an extra two points. I would have been just as annoyed the other way around - and indeed I was after the opening round last year when it was the other way around. You just don't seem to get it, the best team were Poland, and they won, the rule(joker) was in place, so any discussion about what may of may not have happened if it wasn't is pure speculation. A couple of years ago Man utd drew 0-0 at home to Tottenham, during the game, the away side scored a perfectly good goal which was not awarded(mistakenly) there is no validity in the argument the morally Tottenham were the winners because who knows what Man Utd would have done had they found themselves 1-0 down. In life and particularly sport one plays the hand one is dealt, so who can say what approach Poland would have taken if the joker had not been an option.
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Post by Genghis on Jul 20, 2009 17:39:59 GMT
In life and particularly sport one plays the hand one is dealt, so who can say what approach Poland would have taken if the joker had not been an option. Hatcham, I don't see how they could have won otherwise. Hampel would have needed to beat Lindback and I don't think he was holding back there somehow. The joker affected the result yesterday. Australia scored one point out on track yet still lost. It's a bit different to a disallowed goal in football, which is more the equivalent of a controversial refereeing decision in speedway.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 22, 2009 15:38:50 GMT
HenryW, he did but then he had a few problems on-and-off the track, fell to pieces and he's never regained his mojo. These days, he falls to pieces when the heat was on. He somehow threw it away in the GP Challenge last season, going from probable meeting winner to non-qualifier, and ran a last at a vital time at Peterborough on Monday. Winning 4 GPs was a great achievement, but the last of those came in 2003, six years ago. Using your kind of wonky argument, surely Gary Havelock should be in the British team, because he once won a World Championship? When did the falling to pieces begin? i presume post 2006 Sometime in 2003 or 2004, can't remember exactly when but Sullivan did a Lukas Dryml, got caught up in the airfence on the straight with his footpin and landed face down on the track. He never recovered his balls after that.
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